What do you believe and why?

[jester13]

I believe in science and humans. I think most religion is about control and power.Used to just exploit people who are missing something in thier lives or are going through a tough time. i do believe there are some genuine nice non crazy people,who like the social aspect of it.But I like to learn and question anything.
-jess

[sultryscorpio]

."The important thing is not to stop questioning". That statement has always had an effect on me. The thing about religion is that its not perfect, because theres always something new to discover.

[andy41]

`To believe in religion is to believe in utopia,people say science dos'nt answer everything,well it answers more than religion,any philosiphy you can't ask
why,what,when,where,how is just totaly pathetic,I saw Billy Graham on TV
one time saying reason and logic only get you so far,well I am an Atheist
because I believe it to be the trooth weather its good,bad,indiferent to humanity as a whole is erelivent.You've got to believe in something they say
meaning god,reason and logic are the only thing l believe in,to believe in god to me you would need a theory of how the universe was created,the created in 7 days by majic is not a theory.My hero groing up was Carl Sagan.

[greycloud24]

`i was born into a peculiar family and raised until i was 14 by my mother who was a Jehovah's Witness. I didn't like the religion and managed to bounce around through many beliefs. eventually i declared myself pagan and said that any god that is beleived by someone has the power to effect the world through that person.
later i realized that what i really meant is that no god is really true, but the idea of gods is powerful. this beleif in a god has real consequences in the world, some are good some are bad. the problem is that some of the bad ones are really really bad. now i am anti dogmatic and hope that people will open their eyes and see what religion has done for us and is doing for us now.
i am affraid that our holy president is attempting to launch us into a holy war in the name of god.
i am upset that the least trusted minority in america happens to be the most educated minority in america. it astounds me that people can trust in modern medicine yet deny the basis for the technology that made that medicine possable.
it seems to me that a fundamental lack of education is what perpetuates religion. we must strive for a more inteligent and less religous society if we want to solve the problems of the modern world.

[exene (deleted)]

Hello... I consider myself an agnostic, but I am somewhat interested in paganism / polytheistic themes. I believe in the balance of nature and philosophy as a natural science. I wish people used the more logical side of their brains when discussing things like the possilbility of a higher being; it seems like that is becoming a dying art in our society today.

[murky (deleted)]

I was raised as an Atheist and skeptic by my parents. They went through all the struggles you did. I believe the reason I'm an Atheist is, in a word, NUNS.
My parents were forced to go to Catholic schools where they were psychologically abused and beaten by crazy old bat nuns with rulers. When I see nuns on the street, I always show them the same courtesy I would show anyone else, but I'm very suspicious that under their bizarrely outmoded hats and behind their serene blissful faces lurks pure evil in every definition of the word.
My mom always said the baby boom produced more kids than the country was ready for, so nuns were pressed into service as teachers. The only problem was that they were very old women who never ever planned on having children of their own. So, all of a sudden they were in charge of everyone else's children and they had no idea what to do with them. If i didn't know better, I'd say it sounded like God was playing a little joke on them.

[placeboo]

I agree with two arguments presented here: that religion is an explanation for the immediate known universe and that it is a form of control. They both center around the theme of control and can be readily *nalyzed by what we've learned in our own educational experiences. For the natural phenomena like was mentioned, there became associated. As understanding grew religion grew more sophisticated to deal with the stars and the planets and the complicated physics around us. Religion morphs. Catholicism does it all the time, as does 'Scientology' (which isn't a religion), etc. The only ones that don't change to a great degree are the eastern religions, which are better established and haved already gone through many of those pangs. These center on humankind's obsession with controlling our immediate surroundings.
As a form of control, it does control the masses. Catholicism had enough influence during the middle ages to supplant kings and queens. We hear numerous stories, and unfortunately often, about crazy sects not only in the USA but around the world who control their members and the children. Its a sad sad thing.
It is my firm belief religion exists for these two facts, and will continue to exist far into the future, even into the stars if we make it that far.
As atheists, adnostics, or general non-believers/non-religious folk we must remain strong and not cave and fight the good fight. Our brains have advanced this far through evolution. Let's not stagnate our progress.

[picco]

adipocere wrote: I don't have any beliefs. I'm a skeptic. I'm not going to just believe something without any proof or evidence to back it up. However, I don't know enough to say there isn't a god/supreme being/deity. So, I'm agnostic.



Send me an e-mail. I'll try to prove to you there's no God. It takes too long here.

Picco

[tiye_PREV (deleted)]

I'm an Agnostic Atheist. I do not believe that God or Satan exists. I do not know if God does or does not exist or how to proove either. At the same time, if there is proof that there is a God, I will not worship him/her/it or become a believer. (.......waving fists towards non-existing beings in the sky.)

[tebk25]

.If you'll excuse the choice of words... AMEN!

[sniprklr]

`Ok I tried to post this in my own article but the god damn sponsor bar runs over it... UGG... So I will post this as a reply to this thread because this thread is relevant to my article.. Warning though, it is LONG! it's a condensed version of an 80 page paper.. It is also a compilation of common arguments I've had with Creationists.. You can find these here:

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(removed) ... and-buddha
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Feel free to read it or ignore it.. But it's a good read on existence

I will post it below this post...

[sniprklr]

Important Definitions
(feel free to skip this section)

UNIVERSAL SET / SET OF ALL SETS:
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A set that contains all other sets including itself.. A set of substance to where all other sets including itself are comprised of.

INFINITE REGRESS:
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The unknown beginning or base/source of origin.. To where everything had to come from somewhere or something. Making all things infinitely regressive...

[bSOLIPSISM:[/b]
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A philosophy to were only one's self can be verified to exist.. And everything thought to exist is only of one's own imagining...

INFORMATION:
1) "Information is any type of sensory input and output or source to inquiry."

2) "Information as a concept has many meanings, from everyday usage to technical settings. The concept of information is closely related to notions of constraint, communication, control, data, form, instruction, knowledge, meaning, mental stimulus, pattern, perception, and representation."

3) "Information is any type of pattern that influences the formation or transformation of other patterns. In this sense, there is no need for a conscious mind to perceive, much less appreciate, the pattern." It's the sum representation of all things.. it's what gives things relevance, substance, and meaning... It's the core to anything that has an awareness or anything that exists...A self-awareness requires knowledge! An intelligence Must have knowledge to apply!, A Self identity must have knowledge to know of itself!

INTELLIGENCE:
1) Intelligence: efficient definition is: The ability to apply knowledge in order to perform better in an environment. Or the processing of knowledge to formulate a response to stimuli..
2) Wiki: "Intelligence (abbreviated int. or intel.) refers to -------- information with currency and relevance, and the abstraction, evaluation, and understanding of such information for its accuracy and value"

KNOWLEDGE:
1) Knowledge is defined by the Oxford English Dictionary as (i) expertise, and skills acquired by a person through experience or education; the theoretical or practical understanding of a subject, (ii) what is known in a particular field or in total; facts and information or (iii) awareness or familiarity gained by experience of a fact or situation
2) Simple efficient definition: The collection of information on a subject or experience processed and then stored which provides a base for mechanisms such as intelligence, reason, choice, or a response or even an awareness... to which a method of inquiry must be based on.

AWARENESS:
Wiki: “Awareness is the state or ability to perceive, to feel, or to be conscious of events, objects or sensory patterns. In this level of consciousness, sense data can be confirmed by an observer without necessarily implying understanding. To receive and respond to input.

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The GOD Theory's Universal Flaw “Existence


EXISTENCE

EXISTENC is anything and everything without a person, or thing existing as a form of literal nothing.. It is also everywhere and anywhere without a place of actual non-existence... Existence exists because non-existence simply can not literally be a person, place, or thing of existence due to the fact that non-existence's own definition states itself does not exist..Existence represents 0 (zero), or the base to all things in, or of existence. It's dimension 0 (zero), or 0D from which all other dimensions spread out from...

DIMENSIONAL REPRESENTATION

We Can look at existence as a whole through dimensional representation...
We are comprised of the first 4 dimensions, and any substance within the first 4 dimensions.. A GOD would have to be a 5th Dimensional being, and this God would then logically be comprised of the first 5-7 dimensions... And the number of dimensions could be infinite to where each dimension has infinite containment.... hence 1D.xxxx to 2D and 2D.xxxx to 3D.xxxx.. Even if there is a limited number of Dimensions the last dimension in the chain would remain infinite.. A 5th Dimensional being could neither create existence or create and destroy any given Dimension that itself is comprised of.. A God is then not the creator of existence but could only be a mere manipulator of the lower dimensional planes...


GOD CREATES EXISTENCE ARGUMENT

The most obvious problem with religion and religious people is when they speak of a creator that supposedly created everything! This is not only impossible, but it is also requires the need to believe in the notion of reverse creationism..A GOD can not preexist existence to create existence so he himself can exist, or have a place of existence to exist in .. In all cases of religion, a GOD is considered "IN EXISTENCE". A Deity's own mind must have containment. Therefore, it's own mind can not wrap around itself to contain itself in order to represent a Universal Set, or represent existence as a whole. Thus, it matters not what dimension, reality, realm that place is that religious people might think their GOD resides in.. We can then logically argue that any Deity would be slave to the need of existence and a place of existence in order for itself to exist... All minds must have containment, and no mind could ever create the containers to themselves.. No mind could ever fully quantify their own containers or places of existence...

GOD IS EXISTENCE ARGUMENT

If everything is GOD, then everything would be self aware and a form of solipsism! We would then not be separate entities, or free agents from said GOD.. We would thus be GOD!.. So if you even try to agree that existence is God, You don't believe in Christianity.. The bible states that a GOD is it's own entity that resides in the spiritual world out side our plane of existence, and would exist in it's own plane of existence..'Kingdom of God" which would be just Another place of existence that also could not be quantified..

The GOD Theorists must pick between 2 options here: A or B without C.. (the bible states B )

A) God is existence
B) God is --- Inin

[flaviusaetius]

I'm an atheist because I don't believe in gods in the way that most people think of gods, but I'm also agnostic because I believe in the slight possibility of some intelligent design of the universe and we just happen to be in it, for some or no purpose at all. If there is such a creator then it's also possible that we may some day come to know or understand it to extent but never completely, if we get to know it then we have to wonder where does it comes from, so the universe will just continue to get bigger as we know more. Or maybe it's beyond our reality and we'll never come close to understand it.

As for religion, I can't say it's good or bad, I see it as a step in our social evolution. It is the only tool we had to build civilizations upon. It brought people togheter allowing to share knowledge giving rise to science. It is a form of control but some form of control is necessary for civilization, we've seen what happened when Rome fell. Eventually we'll need to do away with it or be doomed by it. Hopefully as science and rational thinking advances it will eventually fade out.

[kafei]

flaviusaetius wrote:
As for religion, I can't say it's good or bad, I see it as a step in our social evolution. It is the only tool we had to build civilizations upon. It brought people togheter allowing to share knowledge giving rise to science. It is a form of control but some form of control is necessary for civilization, we've seen what happened when Rome fell. Eventually we'll need to do away with it or be doomed by it. Hopefully as science and rational thinking advances it will eventually fade out.


That was good, flaviusaetius, I feel a lot of atheists never recognize that. These atheists who call themselves anti-theists speak of religion as though it has been the bane of humanity since its inception.

You mentioned that you don't believe in Gods in the way that most people don't believe in Gods. I'm sure there are some atheists here that experiment with entheogens, but probably wouldn't rather admit it if they're looking to have a certain image as this is a dating website. I had an experience that was the consequence of being influenced by Terence McKenna who advocated what he referred to as the "heroic dose" of psilocybin mushrooms. I had experience with pot, but it was nothing like pot, or alcohol, or MDMA or anything like that. McKenna himself even said that the potential experience that it induces is exclusive to tryptamine-based hallucinogens, and that in order to even elicit entry to these colossal altered states of consciousness is to take the dose range which he recommends. So, I sought that experience and now after mulling it over have a perspective that's closer to something like Hinduism or Buddhism, although I wouldn't consider myself Hindu or Buddhist.

And I would never tell anyone to take this stuff, but I'd surely adhere to the notion that if you want to challenge your ontological beliefs, this experience will do that to the extreme. It's not something you can base your experience with pot on, and then extrapolate, and think it's "something like that." What happens is you're confronted not with the repressed detritus of the subconscious, a sort of Freudian assumption or the collective unconscious alla Carl Jung. I mean, all that is there, but at this "heroic dose" what you find is a mental universe that exceeds any expectation you could have ever dreamed of, and of course, a skeptic or "rationalist" might just judge that as delusion/hallucination, etc. I know I would've, if I hadn't had it. However, I think once you have the experience what you discover is that it's more peculiar than you might've cohered.

McKenna commented on this state, saying that psychedelics "anticipate an end state of consciousness." I'm not sure how true that is, but I know that it was an attempt or a metaphor to describe how profound and seemingly "beyond" the ego this experience is. It may be the mind, but the mind lit up to such a degree that it is seemingly incomprehensible, and it is this colossal state of mind, that you literally stumble upon in your lifetime if you dare so to do it, that people throughout the ages of given many different names. God, nirvana, satori, Brahman, etc.

So, that's my view in a nutshell. The missing factor in most people's lives who try and think about this stuff is this colossal altered state that you can't read about in the newspaper, in won't be in peer-review, you won't hear about on the news, so on and so forth, because the people involved in those trips probably have no clue as to what these things are capable of. And so, anyone reading this can think whatever they like about me and this perspective, but if you truly want to challenge it, CHECK IT OUT!

[kanbay1 (deleted)]

Here is the real story...after awhile Jesus and his gang were noticing that his appeal was waning. For awhile they could stir interest by "healing cripples, making the blind see, etc" by using plants and actors in the crowds. So Jesus, ever the showman, said, "I know! I will rise from the dead!" So they went around and finally found a guy that looked a lot like Jesus and concocted this whole scene with the Romans. That is why Judas had to identify Jesus to the Romans, since he did not look exactly like Jesus. Sounded something like this.... "There that's Jesus!" "Who him?" "Yeah yeah that is him!" "You sure? Kind of looks different..." "No no...that is him..I know!" "Well ok if you say so.." Then after Jesus died on the cross and was interred in the tomb the real Jesus came out and did the whole rising from he dead routine. And Judas was murdered by the apostles who faked his suicide because he wanted more money to keep up with the charade! With all the money pouring in form donations to his religion collected by his apostles Jesus moved away and lived the rest of his life wealthy with numerous wives and children.